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Author Previous Topic: nickj...and The SKi Train... Topic Next Topic: Steam heads, your opinions please
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NandW

Posted - 2009 September 10 :  10:03:44 AM  Show Profile
quote:
Originally posted by Alwyn Cutmore

Micro Scale even printed Heavyweight passenger car decals for N&W so that you can get exactly what you want.




Fortunately, Microscale discontinued this lousy set (it stank!).

Excellent N&W passenger decals are available from ShellScale:

http://www.shellscale.com

For some reason ShellScale has not added them to the site, but you can contact them directly.

Shellscale also sells them on Ebay.

The set is N123.

Mark



Edited by - NandW on 2009 September 10 10:04:44 AM

Country: Pitcairn Island | Posts: 4227 Go to Top of Page

NandW

Posted - 2009 September 10 :  10:09:05 AM  Show Profile
quote:
Originally posted by Dick Wroblewski

Does anyone have any experience with these cars? I'm looking for a set of 6 heavyweights (N&W), but I know that Con Cor's QC is not always the best. Are these cars worth the price [$140 list price]?

Thanks.

Dick Wroblewski



I like the Rivarossi cars. With detail additions noted earlier in this thread they can be pretty good.

The Rivarossi cars are mostly ATSF proto, this site has a nice analysis of the cars:

http://www.trainweb.org/fredatsf/protopass1.htm

There is one error, N&W actually did have full length baggage/mail cars, I forget what class but IRM has one (#1459).

As for the N&W renditions done by Concor, I don't care for the color, it's been too dark in past runs. Also, the lettering is kinda shoddy in my opinion.

I'm painting and decaling my own (of the Rivarossi cars, I am only using the Pullman, Coach, Diner, and Full Baggage. I also kitbashed the observation into a business car)

Mark



Edited by - NandW on 2009 September 10 11:09:52 AM

Country: Pitcairn Island | Posts: 4227 Go to Top of Page

FloridaBoy

Posted - 2009 September 10 :  11:04:17 AM  Show Profile
To me, there is a marked difference in the older heavyweights. Those with the close together windows are made by Lima in Italy, and to me are somewhat inferior to their ConCor/Atlas/Rivarossi mates.

I use transition cars with MicroTrains couplers at one end, and leave the Rapido couplers on my passenger cars, as I install diaphragms on them, covering the couplers, and my experience over the years has been that the rapido couplers while unrealistic are stronger and more reliable than MT couplers on passenger cars (droops, flexes, etc).

At $140 per set, the seller is seemingly attempting to capture in on the latest temporary shortage of passenger cars on the market. Don't fall for it. Look for new manufacturers, Rapido, eBay and Kato to fill that void.

Ken "FloridaBoy" Willaman
Ken "Florida



Country: USA | Posts: 1041 Go to Top of Page

Adrian Wintle

Posted - 2009 September 10 :  11:18:39 AM  Show Profile
quote:
Originally posted by FloridaBoy

To me, there is a marked difference in the older heavyweights. Those with the close together windows are made by Lima in Italy, and to me are somewhat inferior to their ConCor/Atlas/Rivarossi mates.


The Lima coach and combine are reasonably accurate representations of PRR P70 and PBM70 (also called PMB70) prototypes in pre-air-conditioning form. The really peculiar heaviweights are the short Bachmann ones.

Adrian



Country: Canada | Posts: 472 Go to Top of Page

skipgear

Posted - 2009 September 10 :  11:21:46 AM  Show Profile
The Lima (now Model Power) heavyweights are not bad at all once you get the paint off, but there are only two car types, PRR Baggage and a coach. The observation doesn't count because it is just the coach with an open patio grafted onto the back. The Lima/MP cars have a PRR style truck on them, the RivaRossi are a more universal truck.

As far as $140 per set for the Con-Cor 6 car set, that is the going rate when you can find the new release sets that they started bringing back out a year or so back. The new release sets come with MT couplers in the RR truck and work quite well. I believe they come with lower profile wheels also, I need to go look at my set. In my case, buying the new set was cheaper in both cost and time that buying up old cars for $5-10 each, replacing trucks/coupler at $9 per car and painting. Besides this batch of B&O are painted much better than the original RR release which was a god awful powder blue instead of the proper BandO Blue. Now I have about 20 of the older cars to paint and bring up to the proper paint colors to match the new ones.


Tony H


http://www.trainboard.com/railimages/showgallery.php/ppuser/4676/cat/500

Country: | Posts: 2409 Go to Top of Page

atsf_arizona

Posted - 2009 September 10 :  2:31:12 PM  Show Profile  Visit atsf_arizona's Homepage
Good discussion, all, I agree with all the points made above and modify my original comments.
Puddington, thx for documenting what is possible with some time and effort with the
original Rivarossi HWs - I got to imitate you when I get time! :-)



John Sing
San Mateo, Calif
http://home.comcast.net/~j.sing
========
Modeling the Santa Fe's Peavine Line (Ash Fork->Phoenix, Arizona) in the 50s and 60s

Country: | Posts: 1869 Go to Top of Page

SkipFranandFun

Posted - 2009 September 10 :  7:37:01 PM  Show Profile
We have (5) Con-Cor heavyweight 6 car sets; GN, D&RGW, ATSF, C&NW, and NYC. We paid $74.77 to $82.77 per set directly from Con-Cor. A reasonable price,IMO. We also have a Freedom Train 7 car Con-Cor heavyweight set for which we paid $145.98 from Top Hobby. We are very happy to have that!

All of our sets are Rapido equipped, and we simple make the first head end car a transition car with a single MT truck change, as others have mentioned.

It would appear the huge jump in price (almost double) in 3 years time is due primarily to the change in parts and labor to MT couplers. In our case, the "upgrade" is not worth it...and our next passenger cars will probably come from Kato. As we all know, Kato's next release will be the D&H "Laurention"...to go with their beautiful PA's. An eastern, north-south train, BTW.

Skip



Country: USA | Posts: 2283 Go to Top of Page

SecretWeapon

Posted - 2009 September 10 :  10:12:53 PM  Show Profile
I've always liked them.. CC did a nice job on the DL&W's, EL's, & Erie's. I did add a little wieght to them to help trk. better. They are light.

Mike
Someone please make Comet pass. cars to go with my NJT engines?

Country: USA | Posts: 466 Go to Top of Page

2KRRer

Posted - 2009 September 10 :  11:06:53 PM  Show Profile
The old RR cars may not meet everyone's standards, but they are cheap and plentiful for kitbashing and rebuilding. I really wonder how many people will shell out $80 for two MT heavyweights, then saw them up to make one specific prototype car. And then do it again, and again... Sorry, I'm no rich man. I've made modernized PRR coaches, true BM70s, Pullman 14 sections and 8-2-1s out of the RR and Lima cars, and with care you can't even see the splices once the cars are repainted. I even made a complicated PRR parlor-cafe car that is pretty much dead on like the prototypes, of which there only two. Other than brass, we may have to wait many many years until we get a large selection of heavyweights of modern quality level. For my sake, I hope these "inferior" heavyweights are around for a long time to come.


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CBQ Fan

Posted - 2009 September 11 :  7:55:57 PM  Show Profile
This is from the Railwire. Joe from MTL:
"Roadnames still in negotiation, but the price will be under $20.00 for the early schemes. Once we start in post PS Green and Black I assume the price will inch up some. Look for the first release in October. I working with Marketing now to see if we can release painted undec's at the same time.

Joe
MTL"

I think that is very reasonable for the car in basic green, etc. Fancier paint schemes down the road a higher price is understandable.


Brian

Way of the Zephyr

Country: USA | Posts: 2123 Go to Top of Page

Gavel

Posted - 2009 September 11 :  10:06:28 PM  Show Profile
The Rivarossi cars roll smoothly on original metal wheels and look pretty good close coupled with unimate couplers which can be placed into the rapido coupler housing.The coaches look pretty good with E-R Shark IMHO, only wish I had a set of five or six coaches and a Shark in PRR tuscan red. I've purchased these old Rivarossi cars at Timonium for $40 to $50 a set. IMHO $100+ is entirely too much.


Country: | Posts: 554 Go to Top of Page

garyac12

Posted - 2009 September 12 :  01:15:51 AM  Show Profile
On somewhat of a tangent, since it was mentioned.
The Bachman shortie HW, while not prototype works quite well on the small home layouts. When going thru the relatively "tight" 11-15" radius curves, they do not hang out as much as the full length 85ft cars. So while they are not prototype, they scale to the smaller home layouts and IMHO look better. Just use smaller engines, so the engine size matches the shorter cars.


N-Joy
Gary

Country: | Posts: 370 Go to Top of Page

brokemoto

Posted - 2009 September 12 :  07:24:28 AM  Show Profile
quote:
Originally posted by skipgear

Besides this batch of B&O are painted much better than the original RR release which was a god awful powder blue instead of the proper BandO Blue. Now I have about 20 of the older cars to paint and bring up to the proper paint colors to match the new ones.




Just wait until it is time to strip those old powder blue cars. I have no idea what kind of paint they used on them, but it stands up even to brake fluid. It took several soakings and scrubbings to get one of the diners stripped.

C-C did come out with a six car set that had the proper paint job a few years back. The trucks had rapidos. At about the same time, RR did issue the three car sets. There was one B&O in Pullman Green and another in that horrid powder blue. Funny thing about those powder blue things, if you paint the roofs a glossy black, it is a major improvement, and even improves the appearance of the blue.

The B-mann shorties are based on a Northwestern prototype commuter car. There were coaches and combines. In a fashion similar to the Lima/MP car, the open deck observation is simply a coach onto which they grafted an open platfrom.

Thank you for your consideration and support.



Country: USA | Posts: 2800 Go to Top of Page

Sharkman

Posted - 2009 September 12 :  11:24:57 AM  Show Profile
The one piece of information I would like to see, how long will it be to release a whole trains worth of cars. The ConCors are here and now. Other companies like IM/CC and MT need to get a better grip on passenger cars. How can you plan your investment when you never know what is coming. I started with the IM cars and now they are the white elephants. I will not go with the MT's because I maybe dead before the finish enough cars to make a train. Unless they can release the entire train at once, well the ConCor and Kato passenger cars suit me just fine. It is not like MT is saving the world with one RPO.

Our Future is what We Make It!!!!!

Country: USA | Posts: 2559 Go to Top of Page

SkipFranandFun

Posted - 2009 September 12 :  11:57:10 AM  Show Profile
quote:
Originally posted by Sharkman

The one piece of information I would like to see, how long will it be to release a whole trains worth of cars. The ConCors are here and now. Other companies like IM/CC and MT need to get a better grip on passenger cars. How can you plan your investment when you never know what is coming. I started with the IM cars and now they are the white elephants. I will not go with the MT's because I maybe dead before the finish enough cars to make a train. Unless they can release the entire train at once, well the ConCor and Kato passenger cars suit me just fine. It is not like MT is saving the world with one RPO.


Very well said!

Common sense stricks again!



Edited by - SkipFranandFun on 2009 September 12 2:24:28 PM

Country: USA | Posts: 2283 Go to Top of Page
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